Your Webbrowser

The place to hang out and talk about totally anything general.

What is your Browser?

Internet Explorer
8
10%
FireFox
48
62%
Opera
12
15%
Safari
5
6%
Konqueror
0
No votes
Mozilla
2
3%
Epiphany
0
No votes
Netscape Navigator
0
No votes
Other, please specify
3
4%
 
Total votes: 78
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jelco
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Your Webbrowser

Postby jelco » Sun Jan 21, 2007 2:02 pm

I think the question explains it all.

I use Opera, mainly because it is the only browser I know that passes the ACID2 test.

And I nearly hate FireFox and IE - inefficient as they are.

Jelco
Last edited by jelco on Tue Oct 30, 2007 6:13 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby ScareyedHawk » Sun Jan 21, 2007 2:07 pm

lolifox.
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Postby MrBunsy » Sun Jan 21, 2007 2:25 pm

I use Firefox, simply because I prefer it's layout to Opera. IE doesn't compete with either, and I'm not very fond of Konqueror (and I can't use it atm even if I wanted to, I didn't think there was a windows port)
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Postby jelco » Sun Jan 21, 2007 2:53 pm

Actually, there is. Safari is the Mac port of Konqueror, and Swift for Windows. Problem is it's in very early alpha stages, and it crashes a lot. But it's really quick at loading pages.

About Opera's layout: Just like FF, you can customize it any way you like.

Another question: Is there anyone out here with a U3 stick? It was not on the official U3 site, but Opera can be downloaded for U3 here. By the way, it's also available for any other stick, but I prefer U3.

Jelco

PS: For those with an ordinary stick but want U3, try Portable Apps.

PPS: When I bought my Sandisk Cruzer U3, I bought the 1GB, but there was a 2GB in the package. :D
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Postby DueAccident » Sun Jan 21, 2007 3:05 pm

Go go Opera!
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Postby jelco » Sun Jan 21, 2007 3:25 pm

Yay! An Opera fan!

Jelco
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Re: Your Webbrowser

Postby NeoThermic » Sun Jan 21, 2007 3:46 pm

jelco the galactaboy wrote:I use Opera, mainly because it is the only browser I know that passes the ACID2 test.


Is that seriously your main reason for using Opera? If so, then I'm here to inform you that all Webcore browsers (Safari, OmniWeb, Shiira, Konqueror), current nightly builds of Mozilla's engine (Thus Camino, SeaMonkey and Firefox), iCab and Prince all pass the ACID2 test.

The ACID2 test is just a test of how browsers deal with invalid CSS and HTML. I pefer to use hard figures, such as what CSS and HTML features the browser supports. For example, Opera doesn't have full support of the CSS2 unit color (it has issues with failing correctly on invalid values for some RGB constructs). It also incorrect applies body settings to the HTML tag even when the page is parsed under XML modes (this is totally against the spec!). It has some issues with min-height and min-width when the height and width properties of the object are explicitly set, and treats visibility: collapse as if it were visibility: hidden. Due to some other issues, Opera can't even claim CSS 2.1 conformance, something that other browsers (most notably Firefox, which you hate) can claim.

Sure, use Opera if you like it, hate Firefox for any reason you wish, but don't support a browser just because it passes a test based around invalid CSS handling :P

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Postby A. Smith » Sun Jan 21, 2007 4:09 pm

Image
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Postby Montyphy » Sun Jan 21, 2007 4:58 pm

Web browser? Forgot that, telnet FTW.
Uplink help: Check out the Guide or FAQ.
Latest Uplink patch is v1.55.
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Postby mibias » Sun Jan 21, 2007 5:08 pm

0P3r4 Ph0r 7|-|3 \/\/1|\|!!!!
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Postby xander » Sun Jan 21, 2007 5:42 pm

LYNX!

xander
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Postby BrianBlessed » Sun Jan 21, 2007 6:03 pm

Silly fox, you cannot eat letter e.

In other news, AWeb for victory!
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Re: Your Webbrowser

Postby jelco » Sun Jan 21, 2007 6:14 pm

NeoThermic wrote:Is that seriously your main reason for using Opera? If so, then I'm here to inform you that all Webcore browsers (Safari, OmniWeb, Shiira, Konqueror), current nightly builds of Mozilla's engine (Thus Camino, SeaMonkey and Firefox), iCab and Prince all pass the ACID2 test.


Concerning WebKit browsers (Safari, Konqueror, Swift etc), I wasn't sure. My Virtual PC is gone and VMWare recently crashed, so I didn't have the chance to check Safari and Konqueror, and my laptop doesn't appreciate Swift. I knew however, that they were good. My latest nightly update for FireFox has done nothing, I must say. It still doesn't really accept ACID2. Browsers like Camino and iCab aren't in my range, since my (virtual) Mac machines don't work at the moment.

NeoThermic wrote:The ACID2 test is just a test of how browsers deal with invalid CSS and HTML. I pefer to use hard figures, such as what CSS and HTML features the browser supports. For example, Opera doesn't have full support of the CSS2 unit color (it has issues with failing correctly on invalid values for some RGB constructs). It also incorrect applies body settings to the HTML tag even when the page is parsed under XML modes (this is totally against the spec!). It has some issues with min-height and min-width when the height and width properties of the object are explicitly set, and treats visibility: collapse as if it were visibility: hidden. Due to some other issues, Opera can't even claim CSS 2.1 conformance, something that other browsers (most notably Firefox, which you hate) can claim.


You're giving some really good reasons here, I have to admit. Can you give an example page, so I can compare?

NeoThermic wrote:Sure, use Opera if you like it, hate Firefox for any reason you wish, but don't support a browser just because it passes a test based around invalid CSS handling :P


Yes, ACID2 is all about invalid (although I thought it was called inefficient) coding. But I didn't explain myself that well. At this moment, the most obvious reason I can give is ACID2. But the truth is I've been using Opera for 3 years now, long before FireFox got large popularity. The early builds of FireFox didn't compare to Opera (I think it was 6 back then), and I have always been the lonely Opera-user in every group I know.

No browser is perfect (as far as I know). But Opera is the one that best suits my needs. I know very few sites that actually use CSS 2 code, so that is not really a good argument to me (to you, it might be).

To change the subject a little, I'm almost done reviving my main machine, and I'm going to install SUSE again (it has been about 5 months since I last used it, I didn't have the time after the last crash). I used to have Konqueror, but it might be a better browser is available now. Do you have any ideas?

Jelco
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Re: Your Webbrowser

Postby NeoThermic » Sun Jan 21, 2007 9:25 pm

jelco the galactaboy wrote:
NeoThermic wrote:Is that seriously your main reason for using Opera? If so, then I'm here to inform you that all Webcore browsers (Safari, OmniWeb, Shiira, Konqueror), current nightly builds of Mozilla's engine (Thus Camino, SeaMonkey and Firefox), iCab and Prince all pass the ACID2 test.


Concerning WebKit browsers (Safari, Konqueror, Swift etc), I wasn't sure. My Virtual PC is gone and VMWare recently crashed, so I didn't have the chance to check Safari and Konqueror, and my laptop doesn't appreciate Swift. I knew however, that they were good. My latest nightly update for FireFox has done nothing, I must say. It still doesn't really accept ACID2. Browsers like Camino and iCab aren't in my range, since my (virtual) Mac machines don't work at the moment.


Ok, Mozilla branches that passed the ACID2 test were called reflow branches. When the branch landed (i.e. it was merged into trunk (the main source tree)), it worked fine for ACID2, but unfortunately broke some of the underlying CSS support items. Ergo to fix these, ACID2 had to be slightly broken. The main changes are still there, and Firefox 3 (due this year sometime) is going to render ACID2 perfectly :)


jelco the galactaboy wrote:You're giving some really good reasons here, I have to admit. Can you give an example page, so I can compare?


Sure. Don't forget that I was just concentrating on Opera's support (or lack of in some cases). Firefox isn't perfect, but it generally does better in most areas than Opera. Have a peak at Web browser standards support summary.


jelco the galactaboy wrote:I know very few sites that actually use CSS 2 code, so that is not really a good argument to me (to you, it might be).


I'm not sure you realise how much CSS2 contains. This site is using CSS2. If you come across a site with positioned elements, that is using CSS2. This accounts for a large amount of websites :)

jelco the galactaboy wrote:To change the subject a little, I'm almost done reviving my main machine, and I'm going to install SUSE again (it has been about 5 months since I last used it, I didn't have the time after the last crash). I used to have Konqueror, but it might be a better browser is available now. Do you have any ideas?


You have the option here of any of the multi-platform browsers, so have a try of them all and settle on one :)

NeoThermic
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Postby jelco » Sun Jan 21, 2007 10:40 pm

NeoThermic wrote:Firefox 3


Although I don't really fancy FF, I'm rather looking forward to that release.

NeoThermic wrote:CSS2


You're right, I didn't know that was all CSS2. But I haven't had any problems with any site using positioned elements (if you mean the same thing as I do with positioned elements). If you can just give me some CSS2 code you expect Opera to interpret wrong, I'd be very interested.

I really like these kinds of discussions. And I'm glad there's no-one who has openly favoured IE (although someone voted for it).

I'm wondering. Any chance there is much interest in a php topic? It's true that we have the php communities, but this is one of the few friendly communities I know.

Jelco
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