"Blind" Targeting

In-depth tactical discussion on how to lose the least

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How useful do you think this could be?

You guys are gonna be pawned!
10
30%
Meh, we'll see.
7
21%
You're a mad man I tell you, MAD!
3
9%
I like pie!
13
39%
 
Total votes: 33
_Ender_
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"Blind" Targeting

Postby _Ender_ » Fri Aug 17, 2007 7:00 pm

So those of you who follow the 1v1 thread may have heard about this, and some of you unluckier ones have been subject to it to some devastating results. Well, I got a PM asking me how I do it and I guess I might as well spill the beans.

HOW TO NUKE SILOS YOU HAVEN'T SEEN:

1. Ace's guess on the fighters was mostly correct, but too limited in it's application. What I do, is whenever I see a shot coming off of a silo, but can't see the silo it's self, I trace the path of the shot on the white board. Now, you might think "So what?" and yes, granted, that in and of it's self is not that helpful. The guts of it is though that once you have a few traces from multiple angles you can start to see where they cross. Now, there is a fair bit of guess work involved, but after you have a good idea on where the silo is there are a few patterns of silo placement that all of the players worth going through the trouble follow. Simply combine the triangulated paths with where you would put the silo, and hope for the best.

2. This is the real secret of the trick. If you're like me, you scout with fighters to get the silo locations. Problem? Fighters have shit for radar range. This means that often a fighter will get very close to a silo without spotting it. So, you're SOL, right? No spot, no hit? Well, I'm sure you all know how the tracer lines from behind those shots fade over time, however, if you're close enough to the slio, then at the time of launch there will be no faded tracer, only a solid line starting from a point which only begins to fade after a certain distance is achieved. That solid point is a silo, guaranteed. It's this little trick combined with the first that allows for accurate enough targeting to let those birds fly.

When put into application, what this means for you is that fighter wave that almost scouted that silo but got shot down didn't die in vain. Not to mention it freaks people out (looking at you rus|Mike). I'm sure that you're thinking "well, that seems hard for little gain". To that, I would say that, 1: I'm holding a lot of little ticks with this back. I've done a lot of practicing with it and I'm figured out far more economical uses than failed fighter waves, but I want to see what you all think of this first. 2: When the chips are down, and you've been doing this since the beginning of the game, you've got an 80% of hitting in the worst case scenario. A sudden strike on a players silos that he/she thought were still under cover can be enough of a freak out that the timer can save you.

So that's the secret. Do with it as you will. I just want to say in closing however that I have defiantly won games because of using this skill that would have otherwise not gone my way. In addition, I'm now getting good enough at this to effectively double my recon range.

So, I'd like to hear thoughts on this little essay. I'll post some screenshots as soon as I can take a few.
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Ace Rimmer
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Postby Ace Rimmer » Fri Aug 17, 2007 7:08 pm

Well, I for one will be testing this out and seeing if I can figure out that "more economical way" you spoke of. :wink:

On the surface it does seem to be a lot of work but I believe this could have come in handy once or twice. Anybody that's played me knows that I can't resist firing on others silos first and typically wait until I've seen all six before starting my main campaign. This might give me a bit of an upper hand since (if I can do it correctly) I wouldn't have to wait any longer.

*goes off to test*
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Postby _Ender_ » Fri Aug 17, 2007 7:12 pm

I think the thing that makes it most useful of all for silo targeting is that the other guy nearly always thinks you're giving up because he KNOWS his silos are still undiscovered. As such, I've seen players hold back assets thinking that now they've got you pinned, they can take their time about things. Oh look, your silos are dead and the timer started. Win for tracing.
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Postby Ace Rimmer » Fri Aug 17, 2007 7:13 pm

If this is as good as it seems, it's definitely a pro/advanced tactic.

Thanks!
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Postby _Ender_ » Fri Aug 17, 2007 7:20 pm

Image

Some of the aftermath of the use of this tactic. In this one I got 4 silos "Blind". That's nothing to shake a stick at.
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Postby Ace Rimmer » Fri Aug 17, 2007 7:44 pm

Well, I just tried it against the CPU (S. America, me as N. A.). I only attempted to psuedo find two in central America after I crushed its fleet. I was able to kill one, blind and the other was a near miss. So, 50% for my first try.

I only attempted two because I knew the CPU would launch before I could make it down to the rest. When my nukes were inbound (from bombers) it hit the usual mark and opened up. It seems you only need about one fighter per silo if they're spread and the fighter can last through 3 shots.

I'm not sure how a grouped formation would work, but as I didn't want to try and place the cpu's silos for it (kinda defeat the purpose) and can't connect to the metaserver guess I'll have to wait. :cry:

Too bad you can't draw straight lines instead of just freehand. :wink:

In other news, there should be a hall of fame for tactics/manuevers/etc, this along with the I-Beam should definitely be in there.
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Postby _Ender_ » Fri Aug 17, 2007 7:52 pm

Grouping ups the difficulty by about 2 or 3 times, but after some practice it'll get them too.
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Postby Hyperion » Fri Aug 17, 2007 7:55 pm

Interesting tactic but are the resources needed to pull this off really worth it? you'd use up alot of fighters/nukes/in game time...things that could be spent in other more effective ways.

Kudos to you if you can pull it off but there are far easier ways to just scout your opponents silos.
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Postby xander » Fri Aug 17, 2007 8:02 pm

I propose that this tactic be called "End[er] It Before It Begins." ;)

xander
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Postby Ace Rimmer » Fri Aug 17, 2007 8:02 pm

Hyperion wrote:Interesting tactic but are the resources needed to pull this off really worth it? you'd use up alot of fighters/nukes/in game time...things that could be spent in other more effective ways.

Kudos to you if you can pull it off but there are far easier ways to just scout your opponents silos.

I don't think it should use up resources to much. In fact, I think if you attempted to not find silos but triangulate them, you'll purposely get the advantage Ender mentioned with less fighters. I've seen player after player send in hordes of fighters and miss the silos still (micro them people!).

I can just imagine the shock of somebody seeing 6-8 nukes come out of nowhere (from bombers) and land on a silo they thought was still hidden. Heh, would be like the good old days of crossing the Bering.

*fondly remembers unloading all 12 subs on Weps as USSR just before it became public knowledge and his surprise*

Anyway, I'll put it into practice... :wink:

Edit: How about "End[er] It" for short, and seconded.
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Postby walrus47 » Fri Aug 17, 2007 8:08 pm

I don't think this is necessarily the tactic you'd set out to use from the start, but is certainly something useful to add to your game. If things start to go wrong for you then this could be the perfect tactic to give you back the upperhand.

I may start tracing on the whiteboard to keep this option open, but I think in general I'd only try it if I'd no other options. I'd just not be sure I'd be good enough to pull it off :P
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Postby _Ender_ » Fri Aug 17, 2007 8:22 pm

Interesting tactic but are the resources needed to pull this off really worth it? you'd use up alot of fighters/nukes/in game time...things that could be spent in other more effective ways.


I don't think this is necessarily the tactic you'd set out to use from the start, but is certainly something useful to add to your game.



I agree that it is time consuming and difficult, but if you're in that ladder match then those sound pretty good to me if it gives me an edge. Yes, this can cost a lot of fighters, but I'm not suggesting going out there and wasting fighters you wouldn't anyway. All this does is increase the effectiveness of the scouting we'd all be doing already anyway. Not to mention that if you do it all game then you might just start finding silos just because of little things, like they were helping provide air cover in a battle. Any time a silo fires, it gives away where it is, just that little bit.
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Postby MikeTheWookiee » Fri Aug 17, 2007 8:43 pm

I was always led to believe that blind-targeting things you weren't supposed to have seen yet caused sync errors. Oh well, maybe it got fixed in a patch.
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Postby Ace Rimmer » Fri Aug 17, 2007 9:03 pm

MikeTheWookiee wrote:I was always led to believe that blind-targeting things you weren't supposed to have seen yet caused sync errors. Oh well, maybe it got fixed in a patch.

I think thats more along the lines of cheating, not blind nuking. Can't remember the specifics.

In other news, tried this against a European CPU in an attempt to (hopefully) go against more grouped silos. It's definitely harder especially if you add in curved AA fire and fighter fire (when you can't see the fighters). Nevertheless, I can see with some practice this technique being mastered in a short time.
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Postby xander » Fri Aug 17, 2007 9:28 pm

MikeTheWookiee wrote:I was always led to believe that blind-targeting things you weren't supposed to have seen yet caused sync errors. Oh well, maybe it got fixed in a patch.

This only applies when you target units that you should not be able to see, but that you can see due to cheating with RADAR sharing.

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