A Little Help?

In-depth tactical discussion on how to lose the least

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shinygerbil
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Postby shinygerbil » Tue Jul 24, 2007 4:26 pm

I would say spread it. The reason being, if 6 bombers shoot at a battleship, and the first hit kills the battleship, then 5 shots have been wasted. It's flimsy, but it is true that you stand to lose efficiency if you concentrate your fire.
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Postby 0mnicide » Tue Jul 24, 2007 4:28 pm

Ace Rimmer wrote:Because as xander pointed out once, concentrating your fire doesn't increase your chances of killing the unit (there are no hitpoints, only % chance) enough or as much as spreading your fire will/can. I don't remember the specifics.


That's not exactly true. Concentrating fire on a single target does increase your odds of killing that target more quickly, but it also greatly increases your chances of wasting ammo. Since every shot is a potential kill shot, every shot fired in Defcon is more valuable than in most other RTS games.
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Postby torq » Tue Jul 24, 2007 4:33 pm

Ace Rimmer wrote:I actually spread my fire (since it was previously discussed) when I can and haven't noticed too much of a difference. Observer bias?


Yes. Actually I did see the difference when I managed to sink 6 battleships with 4 bombers this way (they fired 4 times). It may be luck, but there is a certain math logic involved in this. If kills are decided by rolling dice every time, you SHOULD spread your fire. Your chances are better this way.
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Postby torq » Tue Jul 24, 2007 4:35 pm

0mnicide wrote:
Ace Rimmer wrote:Because as xander pointed out once, concentrating your fire doesn't increase your chances of killing the unit (there are no hitpoints, only % chance) enough or as much as spreading your fire will/can. I don't remember the specifics.


That's not exactly true. Concentrating fire on a single target does increase your odds of killing that target more quickly, but it also greatly increases your chances of wasting ammo.


Not only that. When you spread your fire you may reduce the probability of sinking that particular ship but you increase the chances of sinking the whole fleet. And the chances of sinking that 'first' ship are still pretty high.
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Postby xander » Tue Jul 24, 2007 5:08 pm

Braddock wrote:
Spread your fire, don't concentrate it. If you have six bombers have them fire at six different enemy ships.


Really? In most RTS games it is best to concentrate fire. What makes this different?

To expand upon what Ace said:

In most RTSes, units have hit points. The more hits they take, the closer to dead they become. Thus, if you concentrate your fire, you take out one unit at a time. Every time you take out a unit, the net damage that the enemy can do is reduced, so your units are taking less fire. So, by concentrating your fire, you are taking out units faster.

In Defcon, each unit has a hit chance against another unit. There are no hit point -- either a shot takes out a unit, or it fails to take out a unit. So if, for instance, you have six bombers against six battleships, concentrating your fire increases your chances of taking out one unit in a single volley, but reduces your chance of taking out more than one unit in a single volley. If you are targeting all of your bombers at one battleship, you can't be firing at another battleship. Thus, the fastest way to take out groups of units is to spread your fire.

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Postby Braddock » Wed Jul 25, 2007 3:15 am

I see.

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