why the different guard types are under utilized

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arwan
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why the different guard types are under utilized

Postby arwan » Mon Oct 05, 2015 4:22 am

i have said before that guards other than the basic guard dont do enough. so here is a list i made of what i could think of off the top of my head to show just how under utilized they are.

i think the k9 unit and armed guard need more AI programming and more responsibilities. such as helping out in a shakedown. or opening doors near them. maybe even prisoner escort if they are not busy.

guard duties
    subdue inmates
    inmate intake
    inmate escort
    open doors
    feed prisoners
    patrol
    deliver mail
    general area assignments
    search during shake down
    search when any other action demands it. (metal detector, dog smells, player initiated)
    run security room items
    will patrol certain areas when not assigned other duties

K9 unit duties
    subdue inmates
    patrol
    search ONLY when dog smells something
    inform you of a potential tunnel ONLY outside

armed guards duties
    patrol
    subdue inmates ONLY when not on patrol and not initiated in a fight by inmate
    will stand in ONE square for all of eternity and do NOTHING if not on a patrol
Mikeldiablo
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Re: why the different guard types are under utilized

Postby Mikeldiablo » Mon Oct 05, 2015 7:57 am

Armed guards are generally a more heavy-handed approach to keeping a prison under control and dogs are too busy checking inmates and anywhere contraband can be hidden for much else.
arwan
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Re: why the different guard types are under utilized

Postby arwan » Mon Oct 05, 2015 8:17 pm

and yet in a game such as this, it would be NICE to see some more utilization of the different guard types and possibly some better/more AI programing so that for example armed guards that do not have a patrol dont stand in one square for all eternity like they are brain dead.
bobybojunior
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Re: why the different guard types are under utilized

Postby bobybojunior » Mon Oct 05, 2015 11:43 pm

arwan wrote:for example armed guards that do not have a patrol dont stand in one square for all eternity like they are brain dead.


Yeah, it would be nice if the armed guards had to go rest in the armory or something. I feel like i built a guard locker for nothing
dapullia
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Re: why the different guard types are under utilized

Postby dapullia » Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:37 am

I have seen Armed Guards and Dog Handlers both also open doors and answer door requests when convenient. One thing I have suggested is that we need another tier of guards which are paid less but cannot fight. These would be Technicians who ran consoles in the security room freeing up your guards to deal with your fine citizens. It would not hurt to also eventually have Trustees. Basically, the best behaved inmates could get jobs working as prison staff instead of just the current ones. These would be jobs that did not require keys such as delivering meals. They would actually go to the kitchen then fetch the meals and deliver them as required around the prison. Maybe trustees could also handle deliveries in the prison as well. A trustee would get a different work schedule in that they would basically wake up at 8AM then shower and eat till say 9AM then work all day in the prison till 6PM, eat, then be free in the afternoons till sleep time. Maybe some would even choose to work an afternoon shift. The benefit for them would be that by being on good behavior they almost have complete freedom within limits. "It pays to behave". They would earn more pay than normal inmates but would also earn extra credit towards their release date based on their time worked. Maybe this could be a factor into the percent chance to re offend and the parole process rather than actually increasing time served.
RJenkos
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Re: why the different guard types are under utilized

Postby RJenkos » Thu Oct 15, 2015 1:38 pm

They may have been walking through the door anyway. Only regular guards open doors by request. Dog handlers won't even open a door for their dogs.
5hifty
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Re: why the different guard types are under utilized

Postby 5hifty » Sat Oct 17, 2015 3:31 am

RJenkos wrote:They may have been walking through the door anyway. Only regular guards open doors by request. Dog handlers won't even open a door for their dogs.



This. Only guards respond to requests - door, search or otherwise. Armed guards, the chief and dog patrols do not search or open doors for others.
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Brento666
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Re: why the different guard types are under utilized

Postby Brento666 » Thu Oct 22, 2015 2:12 pm

You can do some cool stuff with planning alone I find;
-Lunchtimes over, here come the dogs to patrol the yard
-I have dogs vigorously patrol my deliveries, especialy human deliveries.
-Dogs at barracks entrances near bedtime
-Dogs vigorously patrolling around barracks at night

-I like dogs, I have lots of dogs, don't badmouth dogs important roles in ma facilities :shock:

-Armed guards are useful; to impress the heck out of inmates, I have them in max sec hallways and fence entry/exit only. Also good for putting down loonies attacking on a whim.

New staff would be cool ! I m working on a surgeon and maybe a sniper role fore guards...
-Technicians would be welcomed but scripting them is probably impossible atm; guard duties/no guard fighting skills, can't be done right now me thinks. Well maybe, it can be done, who knows :)
arwan
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Re: why the different guard types are under utilized

Postby arwan » Fri Oct 23, 2015 11:44 pm

pathing + planing can do a few things, i also have 50 dogs in my prison, that being said i also have 20 armed guards and a WHOPPING 180 guards because i have to have that many to keep everything running because i cant delegate some of there duties to the other guard types.

the only reason i have 50 dogs is because they have about half the stamina of other staff types (dogs get tired FAST) so you need 2-3 for a 24 hour period. i also have 3 kennels in my prison spaced out so they can get to resting quickly.
my dogs patrol my kitchens for contraband, the main gates and around all my inmate barracks for tunnels. aside from that they have no other "good" role. if i could assign them without HAVING to put them on patrol i would assign a few to the canteen during meal times as well as showers, and yards. to sniff for contraband on my inmates, as it stands its foolish to do so as i can just station a dog outside the barracks doors where they will stand for all eternity on there 1 block patrol and sniff people coming and going.

armed guards are still even less useful, thus why i have the least amount of them. YES they do help calm your prisoners, but a side effect of that is that inmates are less inclined to enter into reform programs, and they move slightly slower. additionally hiring more and more raises the heat of the prison, unlike the other guard types, like the riot police. additionally they do nothing but patrol, currently they are bugged to never need rest. they do nothing else, but the bare minimum that a guard can do. subdue inmates.

before we implement additional staff members, i would LOVE to see some additional love and attention to the different guard types, so that their roles are more interchangeable. and there are more responsibilities for the different guard types. instead of front loading most of the prisons jobs to the basic "guard" you cant tell me someone with a dog cant do everything a regular guard can do and, but better, since they have a DOG! i would love a re balance of how much the different guards cost and their daily costs should be adjusted as well to reflect that.

in my opinion it would be an improvement if the different guards acted more like upgrades from one another, not to the extent that they are pure upgrades, having individuality between the different types is important. but enough that you could at least weigh some pros and cons as to what type and how many of each guard you want due to cost and roles you expect them to carry out in your prison. and possibly a heat generation for every guard type but less for normal guards a moderate amount for k9 units and the most heat for armed guards.

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