Gang internal fights

[henke37]

Nb. untested speculation.

The new gangs system seems to have a problem. What if two members of the same gang start a fight with each other? With the loyalty system this would mean that the entire gang would end up fighting itself. This is quite ridiculous.

To deal with this, there needs to be some special casing. It's unreasonable that members of the same gang don't fight, but it can be "less likely". But that doesn't address the problem. No, what is needed is prisoners judging if they want to come to the assistance of another. This is more complex than just checking gang affiliation, things like friendships should be modeled too. This leads into the idea of a larger structure for gangs.

[Pogmothoin]

I'm not sure why that is ridiculous, it sound perfectly right to me. Nobody gets to be a leader of a gang because they are friendly with all the members. Well maybe the Care Bear Gang.

Gang members fight with each other all the time, some hate each other as much as they hate other gangs. When Chris adds more of the hierarchy of gangs I'm guessing that will be an integral part to gang members become gang leaders etc.

The only thing I'm wary about, is if 2 of the same gang members fight each, and a guard intervenes to brake it up, will the entire gang (most who were just watching the fight) attack the guard? Including the 2 fighting members, because then it will become near impossible to stop gangs.
Or if 2 members start fighting, will any other members near them automatically pick a side and start fighting as well? Thus turning a 2 man fight into a 5-10 man fight in the blink of a eye.

Also with regards to gang mentality I'm not sure it's a great idea for the game, it forces you to make sure they are molly coddled into bliss, because if you don't and just a single one of them kicks off your guards have to deal with all of them, especially if the one that kicks off is an instigator. Meaning that anywhere that gang members are likely to be will need at least twice the number of guards.

[RedTear]

The only thing I'm wary about, is if 2 of the same gang members fight each, and a guard intervenes to brake it up, will the entire gang (most who were just watching the fight) attack the guard? Including the 2 fighting members, because then it will become near impossible to stop gangs.
Or if 2 members start fighting, will any other members near them automatically pick a side and start fighting as well? Thus turning a 2 man fight into a 5-10 man fight in the blink of a eye.

In ever OTHER situation involving a gang, it becomes an even greater fight in an even shorter timeframe as the entire gang intervenes anyways. Why is this situation special? If one gang member destroys something and a guard stops him, the entire gang attacks the guard, for instance. If someone in the gang riots as soon as theres actualy some violence involving another person going on, the rest of the gang also riots, making it an actual full-fledged prison-riot, hopefully not to many non-gang-members follow them but its more likely once a riot is allready up and running.

[Jaryd]

The whole gang mechanic could spread out into a gigantic micro managment where you would reasign every gang member depending on their gang to one group of prisoners, for example all members of gang 1 would be high security, all of gang 2 protected custody and gang 3 high security like that you could in theory split the gangs up so they never meet.

[Lazarus52980]

The whole gang mechanic could spread out into a gigantic micro managment where you would reasign every gang member depending on their gang to one group of prisoners, for example all members of gang 1 would be high security, all of gang 2 protected custody and gang 3 high security like that you could in theory split the gangs up so they never meet.

This assumes that the next alpha or two does not add functionality of "hidden" gang members. That could make this even more scary/unpredictable.

[SpaceVelociraptor]

I feel like this isn't actually a problem at all. What do you think would happen if two members of a gang actually started a fight in real life? Individual gang members would take sides and there would be a big brawl. To address your idea of individual relationships between prisoners, it's been talked about before and the general consensus is that it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense to do. First of all, it would add a somewhat unnecessary layer to prisoner to prisoner interactions. Second, there would be too much micromanagement in order to actually do anything relating to prisoner relationships.

[xPyr0x]

More shotgun guards. Problem fixed.