Introversion

My background in Law Enforcement might make me sound like a prick, but please hear me out.

In my knowledge of how most prisons work, there are set guidelines for the treatment, punishment, and overall care for inmates. I would like to see a new version of 'Policy' or expanding it. These policies range from gang separation, solitary confinement, security levels, and more.

One of the first things that happens when inmates arrive at a prison, be it by a transfer from another prison, or otherwise, they are strip searched, photographed for tattoos and gang markings, placed in specific security levels based on their history in other prisons or their criminal history. Previous cases of assaults or attacks on officers and other inmates place these prisoners in maximum security, and even higher levels (full lockdown, 'the hole', permanent solitary). Their medical history is taken, including medication, diseases (HIV, diabetes, etc), and any psychological disorders. That's just processing, now we get into the prison life itself.

Once inside the prison, different rules are put into place. One thing that happens in many maximum security prisons is that automated door control systems (like the ones we currently have in game) are used to control entire cell blocks (pods). This is often managed by one officer in the 'nerve center' of said block. There is one common rule regarding these controls: One door open at any time. This includes cell doors, main hallway doors, and more. Implementing this rule of 'one at a time' could be used, making it so that one door has to close before the next may be opened. This prevents assaults and escapes. It regulates the control of movement throughout the area, which leads to more security.

Individual persons: I feel there needs to be a 'reworking' of guards and prisoners. The way it currently runs to me, prisoners and guards just roam free with no clear assignment to their area. It seems that guards just 'go wherever the hell they want', and the same holds true with prisoners (I know you can assign security levels). I feel that specific cell blocks need to be set aside for certain types of prisoners, and guards specifically designated to areas based on their training and such. In many prisons, some prisoners with a history of assaults and other violent crimes revoke open rec time, visitation rights, and revoke general population rights. Having an individualized approach to various events and actions. If prisoners get into altercations, be it fights, arguments, or inappropriate conduct, punishments are handed down based on previous history or other factors. Guards don't need to be present most of the time, and could get away with having a squad of armed guards with a bunch of cameras, and just send in the Rambos when they're needed. Some guards are better in some areas, and others are better served in others. For example, guards that are very large (tall, muscular) are best placed on the 'front lines', interacting directly with prisoners that are deemed too dangerous to be handled alone. Smaller guards are often best in PPVs (perimeter patrol vehicles) or manning security offices to watch camera feeds or man sniper towers. Granted you cannot throw the big guys in with prisoners just because of their size, but if a particularly dangerous prisoner needs to be moved to another area of the prison, two or more guards are needed to restrain and move said inmate. This was a wall of text for this portion itself, and wasn't very clear cut... Basically, individuals need to be treated differently. One type of punishment for different misconduct across all prisoners is needed in some situations, but needs to be tuned up or tweaked slightly for 'problem inmates'. Guards need to be positioned differently based on their training and traits.

Contraband: This one is big, and really needs to be tweaked. The way that contraband is handled seems a bit weak. Weapons are an automatic solitary confinement for extended periods of time, regardless of which prison you visit. Blanket punishments work, but some specific contraband needs a different punishment. Possession of too many luxury commodities, such as food or magazines and reading material, simply result in removal of said commodities, and face no real 'lockdown' or solitary confinement punishments. In contrast, shanks, razor blades, or other weapons are treated as though they have attacked a member of staff, and are punished SEVERELY. I've never heard of a prison that has an open arms policy for weapons.

Inmate privileges: Different misconduct can lose inmates certain luxuries. Being allowed to possess food like chips can be taken if the prisoner is in possession of drugs, or makes threats against staff and other inmates. This would be hard to implement, but allowing the possession of different items like food or other commodities would be another method to reward those who behave, and be revoked if the rules are broken. If prisoners were delivered their food in their cells instead of going to a canteen to get it, misconduct could mean that their diet would be changed. Instead of the usual meals, they would be served 'slop', or some kind of crap food. It serves as a deterrent for any misconduct in the future. Losing rec time is another privilege that could be taken away, most prisoners want to work out or at least have some rec time with other inmates, and revoking said time could be another deterrent. They aren't the most severe of punishments, but could serve as to show the prisoners that they could have anything and everything taken away at the slightest misconduct.

Governmental regulations: Prisons are bound by the law, be it state or federal. Certain regulations are in place for the treatment of inmates and staff. Inmates cannot be deprived of food or water for extended periods of time, else the prison would be subject to human rights violations, which could easily result in licenses being revoked. Drug and alcohol programs should be somewhat bound under government regulation, including requirements for some prisoners to be treated while in custody. Some courts' sentences include requirements that drug rehab or treatment must be sought for them to be released. Basically, I feel there needs to be some form of a 'government' that oversees how things are being run, more so than just the current failure conditions.

TL;DR: Go read the post you lazy git, it took a while to put all this together.

Feedback is appreciated.

One of the first things that happens when inmates arrive at a prison, be it by a transfer from another prison, or otherwise, they are strip searched, photographed for tattoos and gang markings, placed in specific security levels based on their history in other prisons or their criminal history. Previous cases of assaults or attacks on officers and other inmates place these prisoners in maximum security, and even higher levels (full lockdown, 'the hole', permanent solitary). Their medical history is taken, including medication, diseases (HIV, diabetes, etc), and any psychological disorders. That's just processing, now we get into the prison life itself.

Iv might be working on that.. Yeah. Not sure though. I haven't been on in a while.

Once inside the prison, different rules are put into place. One thing that happens in many maximum security prisons is that automated door control systems (like the ones we currently have in game) are used to control entire cell blocks (pods). This is often managed by one officer in the 'nerve center' of said block. There is one common rule regarding these controls: One door open at any time. This includes cell doors, main hallway doors, and more. Implementing this rule of 'one at a time' could be used, making it so that one door has to close before the next may be opened. This prevents assaults and escapes. It regulates the control of movement throughout the area, which leads to more security.

Servos?

Individual persons: I feel there needs to be a 'reworking' of guards and prisoners. The way it currently runs to me, prisoners and guards just roam free with no clear assignment to their area. It seems that guards just 'go wherever the hell they want', and the same holds true with prisoners (I know you can assign security levels). I feel that specific cell blocks need to be set aside for certain types of prisoners, and guards specifically designated to areas based on their training and such. In many prisons, some prisoners with a history of assaults and other violent crimes revoke open rec time, visitation rights, and revoke general population rights. Having an individualized approach to various events and actions. If prisoners get into altercations, be it fights, arguments, or inappropriate conduct, punishments are handed down based on previous history or other factors. Guards don't need to be present most of the time, and could get away with having a squad of armed guards with a bunch of cameras, and just send in the Rambos when they're needed. Some guards are better in some areas, and others are better served in others. For example, guards that are very large (tall, muscular) are best placed on the 'front lines', interacting directly with prisoners that are deemed too dangerous to be handled alone. Smaller guards are often best in PPVs (perimeter patrol vehicles) or manning security offices to watch camera feeds or man sniper towers. Granted you cannot throw the big guys in with prisoners just because of their size, but if a particularly dangerous prisoner needs to be moved to another area of the prison, two or more guards are needed to restrain and move said inmate. This was a wall of text for this portion itself, and wasn't very clear cut... Basically, individuals need to be treated differently. One type of punishment for different misconduct across all prisoners is needed in some situations, but needs to be tuned up or tweaked slightly for 'problem inmates'. Guards need to be positioned differently based on their training and traits.

I believe you can assign prisoner sections and guard patrols with the deployment tabs, this includes access areas. Not sure that if guards as of Alpha 24 have any traits.

Contraband: This one is big, and really needs to be tweaked. The way that contraband is handled seems a bit weak. Weapons are an automatic solitary confinement for extended periods of time, regardless of which prison you visit. Blanket punishments work, but some specific contraband needs a different punishment. Possession of too many luxury commodities, such as food or magazines and reading material, simply result in removal of said commodities, and face no real 'lockdown' or solitary confinement punishments. In contrast, shanks, razor blades, or other weapons are treated as though they have attacked a member of staff, and are punished SEVERELY. I've never heard of a prison that has an open arms policy for weapons.

Are you asking for more micro in the policy tab?

Inmate privileges: Different misconduct can lose inmates certain luxuries. Being allowed to possess food like chips can be taken if the prisoner is in possession of drugs, or makes threats against staff and other inmates. This would be hard to implement, but allowing the possession of different items like food or other commodities would be another method to reward those who behave, and be revoked if the rules are broken. If prisoners were delivered their food in their cells instead of going to a canteen to get it, misconduct could mean that their diet would be changed. Instead of the usual meals, they would be served 'slop', or some kind of crap food. It serves as a deterrent for any misconduct in the future. Losing rec time is another privilege that could be taken away, most prisoners want to work out or at least have some rec time with other inmates, and revoking said time could be another deterrent. They aren't the most severe of punishments, but could serve as to show the prisoners that they could have anything and everything taken away at the slightest misconduct.

No comment.

Governmental regulations: Prisons are bound by the law, be it state or federal. Certain regulations are in place for the treatment of inmates and staff. Inmates cannot be deprived of food or water for extended periods of time, else the prison would be subject to human rights violations, which could easily result in licenses being revoked. Drug and alcohol programs should be somewhat bound under government regulation, including requirements for some prisoners to be treated while in custody. Some courts' sentences include requirements that drug rehab or treatment must be sought for them to be released. Basically, I feel there needs to be some form of a 'government' that oversees how things are being run, more so than just the current failure conditions.

The aim of this is that we can run the prison as a European paradise or the Russian Gulags.

TL; DR: Read it....

Kodiak97 wrote:--==<snip>==--

Much of what you suggest has already been implemented or is clearly in the works. For instance, the punishments for different kinds of infractions (including possession of various contraband) can be controlled in the policy tab, and "one door at a time" policies can be implemented with clever wiring (due to lags in signal propagation and door closing, it is a little buggy right now, but the idea is clearly there).

It should also be noted that much of your post seems to be geared to making Prison Architect more *realistic*, which isn't necessarily a good idea. At the end of the day, it is supposed to be a game. In the real world, prisoners hardly (if ever) escape from maximum security prisons. Riots are rare and the prisons normally run without major incident. In the real world individual guards may have assigned patrols and will always have those patrols; in a game, that level of micro is going to be off-putting for a lot of players.* It might be great for a sim-head who prizes realism above all else, but I, personally, wouldn't want to play such a game. The coarse granularity of the players options are important to many aspects of the gameplay.

While I appreciate your law enforcement perspective (a perspective that has been spoken from on the boards a few times), it might be beneficial for you to consider the implications of your ideas in terms of gameplay mechanics. Remember, it is a game, not a simulation, and should be accessible as such.

xander

* Not to mention my spiel about the narrative importance of giving the prisoners personalities but not the staff---searching the forum for the phrase "cogs" will bring up past conversations.

In the real world we go hands on on a daily basis. An hourly basis, even - be that in jail, prison, or local PD holding cell. What Xander knows of real world law enforcement could fill a thimble.

Arcade gameplay is off-putting to a lot of players. I prefer to run a prison, this the name - Prison Architect.

Citizen wrote:What Xander knows of real world law enforcement could fill a thimble.

Thank you for that insightful and completely useless bit of trolling. I have not claimed to know what goes on in a real prison; I have only made an argument from the perspective of gameplay and narrative which, given that Prison Architect is a game, seems reasonable.

xander

I personally love the idea of revoking certain privileges. For example, multiple offenses will result in a change in their daily schedule like no yard for 7 days or the SHU (Special Housing Unit) with no social interaction for a week. If PA had commissary it would further enhance the prisoners need for extra privileges such as cigarettes for well behaved inmates.

Well in real prisons, prisoners are locked down for days at a time.

I saw a documentary where two gangs had a fight and the prison was locked down for 16 days.

I think the option of food being delivered to prisoner's cells would be an idea or it occuring automatically if in lockdown too although it may require some significant programming.

Pegasus2 wrote:...although it may require some significant programming.

I suspect (though I don't know) that the code used to deliver laundry could be rejiggered to deliver food as well, so the coding challenge *may* not be that significant.

xander

I think the "privilege removal" could be easy enough. If rec time is lost, then all work and free regime times become lockdown for that guy. Policy tab would allow incremental punishment, and so on.

Processing rules like searching and placement have been suggested many times. The cell block idea too. The one gate rule would work well if there is an easier, more high-level or design-oriented way to build the wires. Heck, it could even become one of the "cellblock settings" if cell blocks are abstracted to the point that individual settings can be applied to whole cell blocks beyond security class. (like, "linking" canteen, workshop, cell block, shower, and visitation room together using a, pardon the term, "magic wire" tool that would then administratively decides which room belongs to which room)

Even a MS student like me would like a small break from designing logic for those damn doors.

lunaticneko wrote:I think the "privilege removal" could be easy enough. If rec time is lost, then all work and free regime times become lockdown for that guy. Policy tab would allow incremental punishment, and so on.

Processing rules like searching and placement have been suggested many times. The cell block idea too. The one gate rule would work well if there is an easier, more high-level or design-oriented way to build the wires. Heck, it could even become one of the "cellblock settings" if cell blocks are abstracted to the point that individual settings can be applied to whole cell blocks beyond security class. (like, "linking" canteen, workshop, cell block, shower, and visitation room together using a, pardon the term, "magic wire" tool that would then administratively decides which room belongs to which room)

Even a MS student like me would like a small break from designing logic for those damn doors.

Your not alone, I've been around since alpha 2, HS now , gotta keep my GPA up.