Page 2 of 2

Re: [Suggestion] Bring back staff-only door setting

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 12:56 am
by Meeeps
planettop92 wrote:the prisoner will go through staff-only doors only when they have to in order to get to the room.


Hmm, do I miss something? Staff-only doors like that already exist.

Re: [Suggestion] Bring back staff-only door setting

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 2:03 am
by paktsardines
I don't know what you lot are prattling on about. Why would anyone want a door to have a 'staff only' setting when there's a staff only door already in the game and specifically for this purpose?

Re: [Suggestion] Bring back staff-only door setting

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 9:55 am
by VoiD88
Meeeps wrote:Hmm, do I miss something? Staff-only doors like that already exist.

paktsardines wrote:I don't know what you lot are prattling on about. Why would anyone want a door to have a 'staff only' setting when there's a staff only door already in the game and specifically for this purpose?

Both of you should read the OP again and more closely: It's just about the fact that prisoners are still trying to go through a staff only door when they want to go into the room on the other side instead of going the long way around to an entrance they are allowed to use.
@OP: I guess this will be fixed at some point.

Re: [Suggestion] Bring back staff-only door setting

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 10:13 am
by Meeeps
VoiD88 wrote:Both of you should read the OP again and more closely:


My answer was not to OP, it was to the quote I pasted.

Re: [Suggestion] Bring back staff-only door setting

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 6:16 pm
by planettop92
VoiD88 wrote:
Meeeps wrote:Hmm, do I miss something? Staff-only doors like that already exist.

paktsardines wrote:I don't know what you lot are prattling on about. Why would anyone want a door to have a 'staff only' setting when there's a staff only door already in the game and specifically for this purpose?

Both of you should read the OP again and more closely: It's just about the fact that prisoners are still trying to go through a staff only door when they want to go into the room on the other side instead of going the long way around to an entrance they are allowed to use.
@OP: I guess this will be fixed at some point.


I might've been the one to miss something if staff-only doors already function as they're supposed to. As VoiD88 mentioned, I was trying to follow the original problem/suggestion, and at the same time try to understand the inner workings of the game.

Re: [Suggestion] Bring back staff-only door setting

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 6:55 pm
by knoest26
xander wrote:
planettop92 wrote:oh, so I was kind of on the right track. is there a difference between "penalties" and "weights" then, or are they just aliases of the same concept?

The theory of pathfinding comes from graph theory, which is a part of discrete mathematics. Each square on the map can correspond to a "node" or "vertex" in an abstract graph. If it is possible to go directly from one square to another (i.e. if they are right next to each other), then there is an "arc" or "vertex" connecting the vertices that represent those squares. Hence the entire map can be represented by a graph in this manner. Alternatively, the dual graph (where squares are edges and paths from one square to adjacent squares are vertices) may be used.

In either case, the "weight" on an edge represents the cost of using that edge in a path. From an abstract point of view, the weight is just a number. In the example of path-finding, you can think of it as the sum of all of the penalties and bonuses assigned to a particular path. For instance, concrete tile might incur a bonus for speed, but a metal detector would incur a penalty if a prisoner has contraband. The total of all bonuses and penalties is the weight assigned to a particular edge.

Hence a penalty isn't really the same thing as a weight, though the two are related. And, of course, this all depends on the exact implementation in code---I can only speak from a pure mathematics point of view, and discrete math isn't my field, so even then, I won't claim that the above is a perfect explanation.

xander

So each square would have a value for how difficult it would be to pass, and the game will then figure out the route with the lowest value and use it? Perhaps they should then lower the value for lightbulbs because staff always avoids it.

Re: [Suggestion] Bring back staff-only door setting

Posted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 9:22 pm
by xander
knoest26 wrote:So each square would have a value for how difficult it would be to pass, and the game will then figure out the route with the lowest value and use it?

That would be one way of modeling the problem, yes.

knoest26 wrote:Perhaps they should then lower the value for lightbulbs because staff always avoids it.

This is a minor cosmetic bug that has existed forever and has been reported. One would hope that it eventually gets fixed, but it may or may not ever happen. The problem that I see is that "Lights" (one object) are represented by two different objects on the map. Outdoor lights should be avoided, as they are a column with a little light on top. The internal representation of these two representations of lights might not be fine grained enough for the path-finding algorithm to tell the difference.

Of course, that is neither here nor there in the discussion of path-finding through staff-only doors...

xander

Re: [Suggestion] Bring back staff-only door setting

Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:09 pm
by Meeeps
knoest26 wrote:they should then lower the value for lightbulbs because staff always avoids it.


This is fixed with Alpha 16.