First Impressions?

[Soulkeeper]

I first saw it in the May edition of PC Gamer. My thoughts: "Woo, this looks pretty. What the...made by introversion?!? Right, to their site! I want details!"

[Hiryuu]

This is bringing back the spectre of an issue that's been around forever:

Graphics vs. Gameplay

[Soulkeeper]

Well, we all know that IV is biased towards the gameplay, and rightly so! I must admit, I'm often impressed by realism in graphics, but they are a good thing! I'm just not so sure if graphics is good enough an idea to bring out an entire new game for. Heh, then game manufacturers try to put in 'new' features, which are, put simply, getting tired.

[elDiablo]

Ok, I'm not flaming you, I'm gonna flame the big developers.

Where you said "IV are biased towards gameplay", you may be right, but there shouldnt be a "choice" as such! All games should have good gameplay, in my opinion. Yes, realistic graphics, with destroy terrain and complex physics ingame are fun, but as IV said (in their manifesto), why do companies all make their own versions of these? (the answer is money). But they shouldnt have to try to make the game look good, and then forget about the actual gameplay! Surely a game that is more enjoyable, and has great gameplay, etc, will win over one that looks fantastic, but all you do is push a button, over and over again, for 42 hours, for a door to open, so that you can "complete" the game? (Btw, that was an idea of a game that just came to my head, not an actual game =/).

I could be wrong, but the big developers should stop worrying about money, and just have fun making games! *mmmmph!* [/mini-rant]

[Soulkeeper]

I could be wrong, but the big developers should stop worrying about money, and just have fun making games! *mmmmph!* [/mini-rant]

Well, we all know the big developers main objective is the money. Some of them really do want to bring out an amazing game, but there are others wanting to make a quick buck - when this happens, it shows. I know its happened, but for the life of me, I can't remember any examples...they're out there, trust me.

[danielwellsfloyd]

Yeah, it's really sad how much of the world today is controlled by money. You think, "Oh, that was a really great movie. I like that producer now," but the producer is now sitting in a chair with $400,000,000 in his lap.

[Darksun]

To the developers who churn out endless sequels and addons,
To the developers who spend more time on graphics than gameplay,
To the developers who care more about making money than making magic,
To the developers who do not listen.
To the publishers who charge the earth for shoddy products,
To the publishers who force good studios to close,
To the publishers who refuse to try out new ideas
To the publishers who don't takes risks,
To those who have lost their way.

Your times of disappointing the gaming community are over. Many will not
stand for it any longer. Times are going to change, and so must you. If
you do not, you face the consequences. We are the gamers and this is our
ultimatum.

From the disillusioned,
From the disappointed,
From the out of pocket,
From those looking for something new,
From those sick of the publishers and developers who don't listen to the
consumer,
From those longing the past.

Yay

[NeoTheOne175]

To the developers who churn out endless sequels and addons,
To the developers who spend more time on graphics than gameplay,
To the developers who care more about making money than making magic,
To the developers who do not listen.
To the publishers who charge the earth for shoddy products,
To the publishers who force good studios to close,
To the publishers who refuse to try out new ideas
To the publishers who don't takes risks,
To those who have lost their way.

Your times of disappointing the gaming community are over. Many will not
stand for it any longer. Times are going to change, and so must you. If
you do not, you face the consequences. We are the gamers and this is our
ultimatum.

From the disillusioned,
From the disappointed,
From the out of pocket,
From those looking for something new,
From those sick of the publishers and developers who don't listen to the
consumer,
From those longing the past.

Yay

Amen to that!

[Superpig]

It's not the developers you want, it's the publishers. What, you think that developers enjoy making Crudville, The Sequel: IV? We get into the business because we have a passion for good games. The pay's shite and the hours are antisocial so why else would we do it?

Sequels and licensed games come out because it's money in the bank. Sure, the games may feel a bit soul-destroying, but it keeps the company open. The goal of every developer is pretty simple: get enough money to make your dream games. Ask Valve about that one.

The publishers are the ones who cause the problems. They're interested in sales and profit; if the game's good then hooray, but if not, never mind - it'll still sell with the right campaign. They're the ones pushing graphics (and thus screenshots, which work the best in magazines) over anything else. They're the ones saying, "No, you can't have another three months to fix bugs, we want to ship it so that it's on the shelves for Christmas. Quit crying about it, you can patch it later." They're the ones saying, "Hmm... original idea, but we'd like it if you made it more like Far Cry. That sold really well."

"I could be wrong, but the big developers should stop worrying about money, and just have fun making games!"

You are wrong. Games cost money to make. A lot of money. Often reaching into six-seven figures. You're employing 40-50 people - sometimes 70-80 - for 18-24 months, so you've got to pay their salaries. You've got to pay for all the software and hardware they use. You've got to pay for the basic things, like heating and lighting in your offices. You've got to pay license fees, if you're doing a licensed game. You've got to pay for middleware, if you're using it. You've got to pay for motion capture, voice actors, localization, FMV...

The average AAA title (AAA = "featured on front of magazine" type title) costs upwards of £1million to develop.

So please, don't level your misinformed opinions at the "big developers." The big developers, such as Lionhead or Valve, are the ones revitalizing the industry - Lionhead through their satellite programme (studios sharing resources, such as mocap studios), and Valve through their strong support of the modding community.

However, feel free to toast EA. We all hate them.

[NeoTheOne175]

It's not the developers you want, it's the publishers. What, you think that developers enjoy making Crudville, The Sequel: IV? We get into the business because we have a passion for good games. The pay's shite and the hours are antisocial so why else would we do it?

Sequels and licensed games come out because it's money in the bank. Sure, the games may feel a bit soul-destroying, but it keeps the company open. The goal of every developer is pretty simple: get enough money to make your dream games. Ask Valve about that one.

The publishers are the ones who cause the problems. They're interested in sales and profit; if the game's good then hooray, but if not, never mind - it'll still sell with the right campaign. They're the ones pushing graphics (and thus screenshots, which work the best in magazines) over anything else. They're the ones saying, "No, you can't have another three months to fix bugs, we want to ship it so that it's on the shelves for Christmas. Quit crying about it, you can patch it later." They're the ones saying, "Hmm... original idea, but we'd like it if you made it more like Far Cry. That sold really well."

"I could be wrong, but the big developers should stop worrying about money, and just have fun making games!"

You are wrong. Games cost money to make. A lot of money. Often reaching into six-seven figures. You're employing 40-50 people - sometimes 70-80 - for 18-24 months, so you've got to pay their salaries. You've got to pay for all the software and hardware they use. You've got to pay for the basic things, like heating and lighting in your offices. You've got to pay license fees, if you're doing a licensed game. You've got to pay for middleware, if you're using it. You've got to pay for motion capture, voice actors, localization, FMV...

The average AAA title (AAA = "featured on front of magazine" type title) costs upwards of £1million to develop.

So please, don't level your misinformed opinions at the "big developers." The big developers, such as Lionhead or Valve, are the ones revitalizing the industry - Lionhead through their satellite programme (studios sharing resources, such as mocap studios), and Valve through their strong support of the modding community.

However, feel free to toast EA. We all hate them.

You forgot food!:D People can't develop games on an empty stomach! But on a serious note, I do agree with what you said; it's the publishers who ruin it for us, so to speak. Not all publishers, but a good deal of the largest ones.

[Superpig]

You forgot food!:D People can't develop games on an empty stomach! But on a serious note, I do agree with what you said; it's the publishers who ruin it for us, so to speak. Not all publishers, but a good deal of the largest ones.

Food... food... oh! You mean coffee? Yeah, I should have included that, my bad.

[Soulkeeper]

Fine, I'll retract what I said about developers - got my wires crossed...I'll just throw stones at publishers instead. My message is there somewhere, I just utterly failed in wording it properly. Basically, just replace all words: devolpers with words: publishers...unless I'm wrong, in which case, ignore me.

Oh, an neo - I'm well aware of the financial implications of the larger projects out there.

[NeoTheOne175]

Fine, I'll retract what I said about developers - got my wires crossed...I'll just throw stones at publishers instead. My message is there somewhere, I just utterly failed in wording it properly. Basically, just replace all words: devolpers with words: publishers...unless I'm wrong, in which case, ignore me.

Oh, an neo - I'm well aware of the financial implications of the larger projects out there.

Happens to the best of us. Happens to me quite frequently, as it were.

[Darksun]

Some developers are at fault. I know most of them are forced to work on projects, and take them in directions that they don't like by the big publishers, but others rather make a game because they know it will make x amount of money.

Personally, I think some of the more well established developers, who are not locked in contracts with publishers, should break free and 'do an Introversion', ie distribute the game without restrictive publishers. Many games studios have the money and reputation to do this, and make it successful. IV has shown us bedroom programming is alive and kicking, it's time other developers took note.

[CClimax]

Just attended a seminar this past weekend about the game industry, and one of the topics mentioned was this exact subject: With big companies turning into sequel-pushers and becoming trapped in their own designs (ex. EA Sports, Epic Games (with unreal), and potentially Bungie (if they continue with Halo beyond Halo 2)), where does the innovation come from?

Answer: From the independent developer and SMALL developers. AKA Introversion.

I love how they are backhanding today's "Game Standards" of AMAZING 3D GRAPHICS and TEXTURING SO GOOD YOU CAN TASTE IT and the like... instead they are going back to how it was in the days of Nintendo and Sega, gameplay gameplay gameplay. In the end, gameplay is what keeps the games alive (along with modding, but thats another story) and all the flashy whizbang graphics can only hold you out for so long. Uplink was a major hit BECAUSE of gameplay.

Kudos to Introversion!