More accessable explosives!

Post your ideas on where the future evolution of Multiwinia should lead

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Kuth
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More accessable explosives!

Postby Kuth » Fri Sep 19, 2008 9:18 pm

There doesn't seem to be a 'general submissions thread' for little ideas, so here's an entire thread devoted to one small suggestion!

Rockets, grenades... there's been quite a few situations where I need an explosive on-hand (mostly those stupid anthills...), but either my darwinians decide NOT to throw grenades or all the powerups seem to favor the other players (or hardly come with explosives at all).

It's been a few games where an anthill in my backyard has cost me the game, being unable to do anything about the problem.

Prolly the way the game was intended, but ah well.
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Postby NeoThermic » Fri Sep 19, 2008 9:24 pm

A quick solution if you've got the numbers is to make two formations, one either side of the hill. They'll shoot any ant that appears before it leaves the nest.

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Postby Kuth » Fri Sep 19, 2008 9:33 pm

Unless you're flanked from the opposite side by enemy 'winians.

I wouldn't mind so much if there was a quick solution to the anthill problem but... there isn't. While you're busy dealing with the ants in your base, the enemy's out collecting crates and statues. Since Crates only seem to have fallen in my territory once in a blue moon, I didn't have an easy solution to the anthill problem. So I can say an anthill in the base is one way to potentially loose the game.
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Postby Phelanpt » Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:16 pm

Well, you can try to conquer another spawner in another location, in some modes. On others you can send multiwinians hunting for crates. Other than that, I kind of agree with you.
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Postby Phelanpt » Sat Sep 20, 2008 12:08 am

Hmm, just had a game where the multiwinians threw grenades near antnests, and destroyed one of them. Not sure if there were enemy mws nearby, though.
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Postby bert_the_turtle » Sat Sep 20, 2008 12:54 am

They do that when they target the nests, it seems. Usually, the stupid little buggers prefer to target the ants, though.

But don't drop an ant nest directly into a bunch of enemy troops. They'll get blown up.
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Postby Kuth » Sat Sep 20, 2008 1:48 am

Yeah, I guess I'm also turning this into a request to either remove or edit the anthills.

Only time I've won a game against the AI so far when they've dropped an anthill in my base, It was near the end of the game in the final minute or so.

Early or midgame? Anthills mean you won't win.
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Postby The GoldFish » Sat Sep 20, 2008 2:14 am

I think one of the best solutions for ant hills/soul destroyers/spore generators, ie, things that can REALLY MESS YOU UP and usually require a power up to dispose of (which seems unfair to me), would be to give them a time to live.

Just have a neutral airstrike come along and blow up the ants nest after a minute or two, or just have them explode of their own accord.

A nest, or a spore generator or soul destroyer over main spawn points early in the game is crippling, and the only way to reliably dispose of the latter 2 is a gun/rocket turret. Those units might get spawned there 30 seconds into the game, and remain their for the duration. This doesn't really fit in with the weighting system (ie that being down does not mean that you are out). The reason these specificaly are crippling is that, generally, ants/sporegens/souldestroyers won't kill all your troops. What they will do is disrupt them, severely, so you still HAVE the troops, so you don't get any helpful compensation in terms of weighting, if it's even turned on.
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Postby Kuth » Sat Sep 20, 2008 3:35 am

It seems that Black trees have the same issue as anthills. Great idea, but early on in the game I can see them costing a player a victory.
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Postby Phelanpt » Sat Sep 20, 2008 4:10 am

Actually, for anthills, I've found that throwing a swarm of MWs agains them (while a formation cleans the ants) is a good way to get rid of them.
Spore generators seem mostly harmless to me, unless combined with a magic forest.

The black forests seem a bit more unfair, though. Unless you can get another spawner fast, or somehow redirect the MWs out of it without many losses(not always possible), they can make a big difference.

As for the soul destroyers, I don't know. They're hard as hell to kill, but they rarely appear, and I've once managed to lure one that was annoying me towards an enemy spawner.
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Postby Kuth » Sat Sep 20, 2008 4:45 am

In my experience so far, it seems Black Forests GROW. It wouldn't be so bad if there are 2-3 trees, but the suckers seem to spread along the path the Darwinians take moving out. This in turn stifles your reinforcements, and ultimately you're left with a third of an army while the other forces- with their entire armies- split into separate groups to grab more powerups to finish you off. I'm only able to win some games because I got a good head start in the objectives (snatching statues, or that I have more spawn points). Otherwise, in some games, had they gone on for a minute longer I would have lost.

Again, not a problem if there was a way to remove them. But powerups are the only way to do so, unless you wish to sacrifice many darwinians in hopes that one of them will throw a grenade.
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Postby The GoldFish » Sat Sep 20, 2008 6:38 am

I should add the problem with Spore Generators is, that, while mostly harmless, your Darwinians will go crazy trying to move past them - they're more annoying than actually dangerous because they can mess up orders etc and hold up large numbers of DGs who keep running away in fear.

The real problem is not really that any of these things are eternal until killed, it's that enemy players can PLACE often them, and that they often need powerups to dispose of them. Ants nests are only an exception if you can commit the troops to dispose of them.
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Postby Kuth » Sat Sep 20, 2008 11:44 am

Well, tried another game just now... had an anthill stuck in my base, again.

I tried grouping all of my Darwinians in front of the three spawn points. I counted a total of two grenades thrown- nothing else.

Because of the concern for the anthill I lost the game (as the other AI players managed to grab more statues). None of the crates I got had explosives in them, best I got was a shield (great help that was :\)

How did the beta players get around this? Nobody tried the tactic of sticking an anthill in the spawning base?
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Postby vanarbulax » Sat Sep 20, 2008 11:53 am

Kuth wrote:How did the beta players get around this?


With difficulty.
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Postby Tricycle21 » Sat Sep 20, 2008 12:31 pm

Kuth wrote:Well, tried another game just now... had an anthill stuck in my base, again.

I tried grouping all of my Darwinians in front of the three spawn points. I counted a total of two grenades thrown- nothing else.

Because of the concern for the anthill I lost the game (as the other AI players managed to grab more statues). None of the crates I got had explosives in them, best I got was a shield (great help that was :\)

How did the beta players get around this? Nobody tried the tactic of sticking an anthill in the spawning base?


If you meant 'grouping' a formation, then you had no luck. MWs in a formation never throw grenades.
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