Seeds of Religion

[Xocrates]

We were not talking about written laws. It's impossible for those to cover everything. However you don't need a god to devise a set of guidelines on how to behave.

It's not impossible. Also, I apologize, I assumed that because the 10 commandments were referred to above, that constituted a valid reason to refer to written law.

While it may not be technically impossible, in effect it would be pretty much inviable.
Also, the Ten commandments were used as an example. In particular how one could reach the same conclusions by simply living is a social environment.

That's if you work on the basis that society is religious. I would argue that while large parts of society claim to be religious, it is in fact not.

Which either relegates religion to a very niche following, or follows that every criminal isn't religious.

"He Who Is Without Sin Cast The First Stone"? Even good ol' JC admitted that no-one stays in line at all time.

[Ace Rimmer]

That's if you work on the basis that society is religious. I would argue that while large parts of society claim to be religious, it is in fact not.

Which either relegates religion to a very niche following, or follows that every criminal isn't religious.

No, what I'm saying is simple; there may be a couple billion "Christians" on the planet, but out of that number probably a very tiny fraction actually follow what they believe/teach on a regular basis. If you don't practice your religion's tenants, you're not religious. It's the same as a criminal saying "I'm a law-abiding citizen!" while practicing the art of law breaking. No, I'm not equating criminals with people who say they're Christian.

"He Who Is Without Sin Cast The First Stone"? Even good ol' JC admitted that no-one stays in line at all time.

That's because we have free moral choice. And yes, all of us screw up at some point or another.

We've sorta gotten off track here. The original question is in regards to religion as it applies to the rearing of children. Is religion really good for children?

[Stewsburntmonkey]

We've sorta gotten off track here. The original question is in regards to religion as it applies to the rearing of children. Is religion really good for children?

I'm not sure it's gone that far off track. The general answer seems to be that certain elements present in religion are almost certainly good for children. These would be things like discipline, concern for things greater than yourself, charity, etc.. However none of these is exclusively the domain of religion and can be imparted as easily to a child without the aid of religion as with it. I don't know that anyone has pointed to anything unique to religion that renders a religious upbringing as superior in general to a non-religious one.

[Ace Rimmer]

Way to squash the discussion Stews.

[Rkiver]

I will not use religion as any sort of discipline marker, especially not the normal one here from Ireland. Like Catholicism can really claim any moral high ground. I will set and enforce rules by grounding, removal of priviledges, and if needed a smack to the bottom.

In short my children will be taught the truth, in so much lots of people believe lots of different things that really make no bloody sense. Religion will have no place in my household.

[Ace Rimmer]

Just out of curiosity, what would you do if they started to become religious (not the same as show a large interest in religion). Would it be like what TV/Movies have in recent times portrayed parents who have issues stemming from their children "coming out of the closet"? Or, would it simply be a matter of agree to disagree, so let's not talk religion (or something similar).

Expanding on that thought, I have seen people change their views once they were challenged by someone close. Could that happen?

Example:

Husband: There is no god.
Wife: There is too, I've proved it to myself and you can't prove me wrong!
Husband: Oh yeah! Watch me.... <insert time for copious "research" here> Hmm, I can't argue with you, I have searched high and low and there must be a god...

Now, that might be very oversimplified and extreme, but still you get the point.

[Rkiver]

7 years together, that's what Aoife and I have. Her beliefs would be nature based, if any. She has challenged my beliefs, I have challenged hers, but we agree to disagree, we also agree on raising our children without religion.

If they wish to follow a religion, that is their choice, once they are old enough to research it fully. And if they wish to join one they better look into it fully. As long as they are happy and safe I wont mind overall, but I would want them to steer clear of certain religions, Jehovahs wintess, mormon, scientology and the like.

[Why?]

I was watching an old Jeffrey Dahmer(serial killer) interview last week, and they were trying to figure out what, if anything, could be blamed for his behavior. Even tho his dad sometimes beat his mom, he said his family was very loving and supportive. They were Jewish, but didn't push it on Jeff. He says his parents weren't to blame in any way shape or form. The culprit, in his eyes, was his Atheist beliefs. He said, 'Having no God, cheapens life.' Said that he didn't enjoy the killing. That was the worst part. He just wanted to make zombie sex slaves, and if not, keeping pieces of them. Eating to make them a part of him.

Evidently he found Jesus long ago...

[Xocrates]

I was watching an old Jeffrey Dahmer(serial killer) interview last week, and they were trying to figure out what, if anything, could be blamed for his behavior. Even tho his dad sometimes beat his mom, he said his family was very loving and supportive. They were Jewish, but didn't push it on Jeff. He says his parents weren't to blame in any way shape or form. The culprit, in his eyes, was his Atheist beliefs. He said, 'Having no God, cheapens life.' Said that he didn't enjoy the killing. That was the worst part. He just wanted to make zombie sex slaves, and if not, keeping pieces of them. Eating to make them a part of him.

Evidently he found Jesus long ago...

Are you trying to make a point, or just sharing a disturbing and self contradicting story?

[KingAl]

Serial killers are known for their incisive perspectives on morality.

[Rkiver]

I was watching an old Jeffrey Dahmer(serial killer) interview last week, and they were trying to figure out what, if anything, could be blamed for his behavior. Even tho his dad sometimes beat his mom, he said his family was very loving and supportive. They were Jewish, but didn't push it on Jeff. He says his parents weren't to blame in any way shape or form. The culprit, in his eyes, was his Atheist beliefs. He said, 'Having no God, cheapens life.' Said that he didn't enjoy the killing. That was the worst part. He just wanted to make zombie sex slaves, and if not, keeping pieces of them. Eating to make them a part of him.

Evidently he found Jesus long ago...

Ah yes because not being religious cheapens life...

Bullshit. I see plenty of religions cheapening it.

[xander]

I was watching an old Jeffrey Dahmer(serial killer) interview last week, and they were trying to figure out what, if anything, could be blamed for his behavior. Even tho his dad sometimes beat his mom, he said his family was very loving and supportive. They were Jewish, but didn't push it on Jeff. He says his parents weren't to blame in any way shape or form. The culprit, in his eyes, was his Atheist beliefs. He said, 'Having no God, cheapens life.' Said that he didn't enjoy the killing. That was the worst part. He just wanted to make zombie sex slaves, and if not, keeping pieces of them. Eating to make them a part of him.

Evidently he found Jesus long ago...

Yes... because the best representatives of any group are the psychopaths. By that metric, perhaps we should condemn Protestants for the acts of Hitler? Or Episcopalians for the acts of Henry VIII?

xander

[LadySnowhitepink]

an interesting question

sure religious could be good for children and also bad.
if religion helps parents fo feel save and to be integrated in a system it could help children too.
but the point is how we interprate religion.
black and white like good and bad?
or "der Mensch ist das Gefäss der Sünde" (the humans are the bottle of sin)
or heaven and hell?
nice something to hope and to fear
and often religion dont open the mind of children.


but what is good for children?
children need stability. means love of parents and time together with them. and i think most important is that parents are not allways negativ. in my case my parents allways told me we have no money bad times will came and so on ....and it was not really true.
that makes children passive and they dont believe there could happen something good in future.

and now to meaning of believe
i dont know if it helps if you believe in god. because i dont do it. maybe it would changes some things.
think this question must be answered by someone who really believes there is a god. but if religion helps to learn to believe in something than it´s good.

i think religion is either good or bad.
and in bad times religion is more popular then in good times. it could help if there is no hope.
so pray if there is no wayout.

it belongs how people interpretate religion and what reactions they do because of that.
also if we look at history religion is one of the most dangerous weapons we have.


sorry about my terrible english

[Why?]

I was watching an old Jeffrey Dahmer(serial killer) interview last week, and they were trying to figure out what, if anything, could be blamed for his behavior. Even tho his dad sometimes beat his mom, he said his family was very loving and supportive. They were Jewish, but didn't push it on Jeff. He says his parents weren't to blame in any way shape or form. The culprit, in his eyes, was his Atheist beliefs. He said, 'Having no God, cheapens life.' Said that he didn't enjoy the killing. That was the worst part. He just wanted to make zombie sex slaves, and if not, keeping pieces of them. Eating to make them a part of him.

Evidently he found Jesus long ago...

Are you trying to make a point, or just sharing a disturbing and self contradicting story?

I was just sharing what I saw... The discussion in this thread reminded me of it.

I'm Agnostic, and think Atheism had little to do with Dahmer's behavior. However, it's kind of strange hearing a serial killer sing the same tune as the pious people.

[Jackmine11]

Hi everyone, I see that there is a lot of discussion about religion here, so I would like to share some knowledge. I recently came across a site called https://biblesays.ai/, but I have to admit it is quite legit. I asked him a question about pandemics and he gave me some historical information that I never would have known about. Definitely worth a try if you're curious about what the Bible says on any subject.