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elDiablo
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Postby elDiablo » Sat Dec 02, 2006 9:22 pm

The matrices chapter starts on page 735 into the book, with some semi-simple definitions leading onto more complex stuff in a few pages. It doesn't teach matrices maths, but it defines the basic operations (scalar-matrix multiplication, m-m addition, m-m multiplications, associative law, etc.) in that late chapter.

Before that, it teachs the use of matrices in OpenGL (4x4 translation, rotation and scale matrices), but I found it quite easy to pick up. I don't really know from a TA's point of view I'm afraid :(
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Postby NeoThermic » Sat Dec 02, 2006 10:12 pm

Well, can't hurt to throw both books at them.

Well, actually, 3.24Kg might hurt :)

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Postby wwarnick » Sun Dec 03, 2006 3:52 am

NeoThermic wrote:My suggestion would be to get a general 3D graphics book (i.e. one that covers theory rather than language), and then once you've learnt about that (such as 3D math (vectors, matrix math, lines, collision detection, etc), ideas of object orentated development (singletons, polymorphisim, inheritence, etc), etc), you can then make the choice between DirectX or OpenGL.

Having said that, I'm going to be hypocritical and suggest that you try obtain a copy of Computer Graphics with OpenGL (3rd Edition), as it covers both aspects.

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I know oop inside out. As for 3D math, I may not know it too well, but I learn fastest when I have something to play with. 75% or more of my programming knowledge came from experimentation with personal projects at home rather than from an instructor. My problem isn't the 3D math or programming experience. My only problem at this point is finding a tutorial or book that is up-to-date with the latest Managed DX library so that I'll have code that will actually compile. However, I haven't really considered OpenGL. Which is more difficult? At this point, I don't care which is better, I just want whatever's easiest. Is there even a managed OpenGL?

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Postby NeoThermic » Sun Dec 03, 2006 4:25 am

wwarnick wrote:I know oop inside out. As for 3D math, I may not know it too well, but I learn fastest when I have something to play with. 75% or more of my programming knowledge came from experimentation with personal projects at home rather than from an instructor. My problem isn't the 3D math or programming experience. My only problem at this point is finding a tutorial or book that is up-to-date with the latest Managed DX library so that I'll have code that will actually compile. However, I haven't really considered OpenGL. Which is more difficult? At this point, I don't care which is better, I just want whatever's easiest. Is there even a managed OpenGL?

wwarnick


I'm not sure why you would want a managed OpenGL. Glut or SDL as your window manager, OpenGL itself as the drawing aspect, and you've got everything bar sound (at which you can either use OpenAL or DirectSound).

As for ease, generally if you know how to do it in DirectX, there's a decent way to translate that down to OpenGL.

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Postby wwarnick » Sun Dec 03, 2006 6:16 am

Would OpenGL even be compatible with .NET? I was under the impression that managed code required managed libraries.

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Postby elDiablo » Sun Dec 03, 2006 10:08 am

OpenGL is a lot easier to pick up then DX, IMO. However, they both do things differently, and each have parts which are better in one then the other.

Oh, and because I'm a Java lover, I do all my OpenGL working in JOGL (Java OpenGL) with hardly any hits to performance, and then port it over to c++ as it's pretty much the same code (minus some OOness). Check out some of the JOGL webstarts which have examples for OpenGL that load in your browser, or the DX SDK which is bundled with lotsa examples! The webstarts are pretty cool, especially the refraction one.

As far as I know, .NET doesn't touch OpenGL as MS want you to use DX.
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Postby wwarnick » Sun Dec 03, 2006 9:54 pm

Microsoft can't stop OpenGL from supporting .NET.

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Postby elDiablo » Mon Dec 04, 2006 9:29 am

Ah! Sorry, misread your question! Yes, OpenGL is compatible with .NET in the sense that I use VS.NET to code my C++ OpenGL, and distribute the exes. You can use OpenGL in .NET applications. However, the .NET framework (specificed by MS) does not include OpenGL (which is what I thought you were asking for some reason). My bad!
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Postby wwarnick » Mon Dec 04, 2006 10:43 pm

Hmm... I didn't realize that. I think I'll look into OpenGL then. Thanks.

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Postby martin » Tue Dec 05, 2006 5:26 pm

wwarnick wrote:
martin wrote:(yes , I program on vb)

Hey, no hard feelings. Besides, with all the changes in the transition to .NET, VB is very much like c# with different syntax. c# is practically vb.net with Java syntax and some extra power. Nevertheless, the transition isn't so bad (if you ever thought of switching).

About DX books. The first one I got had bad code to begin with. It was plain old terrible. And it didn't explain well, etc. etc. Then I looked at reviews and found one with high ratings: Beginning 3D Game Programming (I think that's the title), written by the head of the Managed DX development team. However, it covered an old version of the library. Any tips? (preferably these books wouldn't be insanely expensive)

Note - I just got Allegnet (Allegro.NET), which I will use until I get a good DX book or tutorial.

wwarnick


yay! someone else who understands that VB isn't all bad ;)
It's a very good language to learn coding from scratch (ie, where I am now), although directX is being a bitch atm. Any advice anyone on DirectX in VB?
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Postby wwarnick » Sat Jan 20, 2007 3:16 am

I downloaded Microsoft's XNA express framework the other day and have been playing with it. It does all the nitty gritty initialization work for you so you can get right to the graphics. Also, it allows you to make games for xbox (I don't have one, but you might). Unfortunately, only the express version has been released so far, so you'll have to use studio express; you can't use studio professional or anything. But the full version of XNA should be coming out in the near future, and I'm fairly excited about it.

Note - It's C# only at the moment. And from the looks of it, it's a complete alternative to Managed DX, not a wrapper.

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Postby KingAl » Sat Jan 20, 2007 3:22 am

wwarnick wrote:Note - It's C# only at the moment.


Why would Microsoft only support their proprietary language at the moment? Surely, everything they do is for the good of the programmer!
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Postby wwarnick » Fri Jan 26, 2007 6:02 pm

Not sure why (or maybe I am). Either way, I use C# so I'm satisfied.

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