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Montyphy
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Postby Montyphy » Tue Aug 08, 2006 2:53 pm

xander wrote:Well, Sonic the Hedgehog was the first video game I ever owned (and the first video game that I ever played that was not composed entirely of ASCII chars), so it holds a special place in my heart.


Yea, I'm the same with the early Mario titles. They were pretty much the first and only games I played and owned. It wasn't for a few years after playing Mario that I played Sonic and I think that was on the Master System.

Looks like Ninteno's and Sega's marketing campaigns worked. :P

xander wrote:It doesn't suffer from the insane number of characters that later games suffer from, adds the spin dash and Super Sonic


I read an article in last months Edge magazine about the new Sonic title. Things don't sound too promising for that either. You can play it through too a certain degree with each of the three characters; Sonic, Knuckles and Silver. Each of characters levels and gameplay are different based on their abilities. Which would make it seem to be fairly interesting but the reviewer obviously didn't think so. Silver's gameplay is apparently very scripted and boring.

xander wrote:If you happen to have a Sonic II and a Sonic and Knuckles cartridge lying around (or the Sonic Mega Collection+ for PS2 -- that was the other reason to buy a PS2 -- my Genesis died), you can play Sonic II through as Knuckles. Most of the levels are quite easy, because he has abilities that were not taken into account when the levels were designed. However, he also cannot jump as high as Sonic or Tails, which makes the final boss a bitch and a half. Honestly, defeating that boss with Knuckles is one of the harder video game challenges out there, IMNSHO.


Never knew you could play as Knuckles in the second one and I don't think I even completed it. I did at least know you could control Tails. :P
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Postby xander » Tue Aug 08, 2006 3:10 pm

Montyphy wrote:Never knew you could play as Knuckles in the second one and I don't think I even completed it. I did at least know you could control Tails. :P

Yeah, that Sonic and Knuckles cartridge was some kind of magic. Attached to Sonic III, it opened up whole new areas in Sonic III. Attached to Sonic II, it allowed you to play as Knuckles. Attached to Sonic the Hedgehog (with a button mash), you could play blue sphere levels (the bonus levels from Sonic III) until your eyes crossed. Attached to any other game, it would let you play a single blue sphere level.

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Postby NeoThermic » Tue Aug 08, 2006 3:21 pm

xander wrote:Honestly, defeating that boss with Knuckles is one of the harder video game challenges out there, IMNSHO.


IMNSHO, the hardest thing to do was to beat Super Mario World in under 15 mins :P

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Postby xander » Tue Aug 08, 2006 3:39 pm

NeoThermic wrote:
xander wrote:Honestly, defeating that boss with Knuckles is one of the harder video game challenges out there, IMNSHO.


IMNSHO, the hardest thing to do was to beat Super Mario World in under 15 mins :P

NeoThermic

It may well be. I never played the game :P

That being said, I have never been very interested in timed challenges. To me, a challenge to beat a time limit is akin to saying, "Well, X really isn't that challenging, so we will attempt to make it a challenge by putting an arbitrary time limit on it." I know, on some level, that isn't really the case, but it always feels that way to me.

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Postby alphager » Tue Aug 08, 2006 3:49 pm

Montyphy wrote:
alphager wrote:Then i pity you. Where in the world do they still use Ada ?!


Ada95 is very popular in regards to realtime systems so quite a few universities teach it in their modules, especially the modules that cover time critical systems. The Computer Science department at York University is particularly keen on Ada.

You are 20/21 and have allready visited modules on real-time/time critical systems? Damn, i did something wrong with my education.

I know that Ada95 is widely used in some fields of the industry, but assumed that with your age, you couldn't have had contact with one of those fields.
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Postby Montyphy » Tue Aug 08, 2006 4:10 pm

NeoThermic wrote:IMNSHO, the hardest thing to do was to beat Super Mario World in under 15 mins


Or, Super Mario III in 11 minutes :wink:

alphager wrote:You are 20/21 and have allready visited modules on real-time/time critical systems? Damn, i did something wrong with my education.


I haven't had to do the time critical systems modules yet. Thats 3rd year stuff, which reminds me of when I did some tour guide work for the department, they had one of Phd student give the same tedious joke to every group regarding a plane not being able to fit in the labs so the students work on a marble sorting machine instead.

The reason they taught us Ada was so that we knew it for the later modules and because the university has links to the language's history. I think some of the staff helped develop a compiler for it or something. Can't really remember.

alphager wrote:I know that Ada95 is widely used in some fields of the industry, but assumed that with your age, you couldn't have had contact with one of those fields.


I can't even think of an occassion where a time critical application would apply where I work. The closest example I can think of is Dirac, which has recently been optimised to encode SD TV in real time meaning live broadcasts over IP could be possible.
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Postby trickfred » Tue Aug 08, 2006 4:51 pm

My kid kicks my ass at Sonic now. :D

(That Mega collection's on the GC as well.)
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Postby xander » Tue Aug 08, 2006 4:54 pm

trickfred wrote:My kid kicks my ass at Sonic now. :D

(That Mega collection's on the GC as well.)

Yeah, I think there is an XBox version, too. I really like the disk, but it pisses me off that so much of the content must be unlocked. I still haven't gotten around to unlocking Sonic II and Knuckles...

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Postby trickfred » Tue Aug 08, 2006 4:57 pm

xander wrote:That being said, I have never been very interested in timed challenges. To me, a challenge to beat a time limit is akin to saying, "Well, X really isn't that challenging, so we will attempt to make it a challenge by putting an arbitrary time limit on it." I know, on some level, that isn't really the case, but it always feels that way to me.


I agree. I really dig the Metroid Prime games; the best ending's based on % completed, and not time limit - whereas the new Metroid GBA games are all time AND % complete to get the best endings/unlocks/whatever. And some of the items are damn near impossible to get without hours of practice, resetting, trying again, until it becomes an exercise in muscle memory, and no longer fun. :cry:

Edit:

xander wrote:
trickfred wrote:My kid kicks my ass at Sonic now. :D

(That Mega collection's on the GC as well.)

Yeah, I think there is an XBox version, too. I really like the disk, but it pisses me off that so much of the content must be unlocked. I still haven't gotten around to unlocking Sonic II and Knuckles...

xander


...Drake's unlocked just about everything now; he switches games every 5-10 minutes. :D
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Postby xander » Tue Aug 08, 2006 6:59 pm

trickfred wrote:...Drake's unlocked just about everything now; he switches games every 5-10 minutes. :D

Man, I really need a kid with ADD of my own :P

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Postby NeoThermic » Tue Aug 08, 2006 7:17 pm

xander wrote:That being said, I have never been very interested in timed challenges. To me, a challenge to beat a time limit is akin to saying, "Well, X really isn't that challenging, so we will attempt to make it a challenge by putting an arbitrary time limit on it." I know, on some level, that isn't really the case, but it always feels that way to me.

xander


Warning: Alternative point of view below.

A time challenge isn't saying "X is boring lets make it fun". It's more like saying "I'm a master of game X, and to prove it, here's me beating it in record time".

Look at the 100% timeruns. The are amazing in the sense that they plan everything. They love the game so much that the know all the quirks, the timings, the obscure stuff (for example, in SMW, if you wait for 3 frames (about 1/3rd a second), it changes the starting position and count of the enimies in the level ahead).

My timeruns in Darwinia show the quirks and the quickest way to complete things. The under 5mins per level I'm doing is not a 100% challenge, correct, but it shows just how quick one can do the game. For example, I know all the timings in Darwinia. I know exactly how long it takes to get a control tower to the point where you can spawn programs there (and you don't have to fully reprogram it to do this). In one of my videos, I use this to my advantage to spawn a squad to protect the engineer so it can finish the reprogram.

A challenge on top of an already challenging game is basicaly a way to show off and show just how well the game is made (For example, you can't better some of the level times in SMW due to the complex mix of score, speed and the location of everything. That takes some skill to get the same time).

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Postby trickfred » Tue Aug 08, 2006 7:49 pm

NeoThermic wrote:For example, I know all the timings in Darwinia. I know exactly how long it takes to get a control tower to the point where you can spawn programs there (and you don't have to fully reprogram it to do this).


...You mean everyone doesn't know that? I usually draw up a second/third engineer once it hits that point to help finish the job. Or a Squad to provide cover fire until it's done. Often both.
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Postby NeoThermic » Tue Aug 08, 2006 8:09 pm

trickfred wrote:
NeoThermic wrote:For example, I know all the timings in Darwinia. I know exactly how long it takes to get a control tower to the point where you can spawn programs there (and you don't have to fully reprogram it to do this).


...You mean everyone doesn't know that? I usually draw up a second/third engineer once it hits that point to help finish the job. Or a Squad to provide cover fire until it's done. Often both.


But the exact time? In seconds?

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Postby Montyphy » Tue Aug 08, 2006 8:42 pm

Seconds? I know it down to the nearest picosecond :P
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