UKRAINE??

[Siсiliаn Ноundd]

[Zorotama]

Trust me guys, I don't want to be sensitive but if we discuss about an argument we have also to obtain arguments trough the discussion. Otherwise we will have only a collection of monologues.
Only cows considered my presence in this thread and answered from his point of view, the rest of the discussion is only a repetition of your positions.

Kudi, basically you say that Russia did the first move. But this is properly the point that we have to (we can) discuss. The Ukrainan crisis doesn't start when the TV News starts to talk about it. Who did the first move?

I don't know who is the bad guy in this situation (honestly I see only bad guys here) but surely UE and USA are following a long line of reasoning (economically and military) to neutralize Russia. I repeat that the AEGIS system of defence is tipically an act of war. What US would do if Canada and Mexico place a sort of AEGIS stuff on the US border and if Canada would support a French rebellion in Lousiana and Mexico would support an Ispanic rebellion in California?

[kudayta]

Trust me guys, I don't want to be sensitive but if we discuss about an argument we have also to obtain arguments trough the discussion. Otherwise we will have only a collection of monologues.
Only cows considered my presence in this thread and answered from his point of view, the rest of the discussion is only a repetition of your positions.

Kudi, basically you say that Russia did the first move. But this is properly the point that we have to (we can) discuss. The Ukrainan crisis doesn't start when the TV News starts to talk about it. Who did the first move?

I don't know who is the bad guy in this situation (honestly I see only bad guys here) but surely UE and USA are following a long line of reasoning (economically and military) to neutralize Russia. I repeat that the AEGIS system of defence is tipically an act of war. What US would do if Canada and Mexico place a sort of AEGIS stuff on the US border and if Canada would support a French rebellion in Lousiana and Mexico would support an Ispanic rebellion in California?

Ok. Let me get this straight: A defense system that is used primarily to detect and destroy inbound ballistic missiles is an act of war? This is a purely defensive weapon system. So, the people of the world should just let Russia fire off ballistic missiles without any attempt to counteract them?

And Canada already has radar installations on or near the US border. The US helped pay for them during the Cold War as early warning sites for Russian bombers.

[Baton101]

The hottest place in Hell is reserved for those who remain neutral in times of great moral conflict.
Martin Luther King

Finding Russia guilty for Ukraine is like having Iraq guilty for nuclear weapons which have never been found

Europe dont feel threat from the Russia. Russian people have always lived in Europe and there is no Europe without them. Russia will never occupy foreign country. Thats only false paranoia, remaining from the cold war. Dont forget also Russia "saved" Europe from the nazis.

We, the people of eu want friendly relationship with Russia. we dont want to follow any imperialistic slaves politicans who says different.



This voting on N-tv was censored and displayed for only a sec or 2 but someone recorded it and put it on internet. Fact is, people of eu think different than they sold out politicans. We will never see Russia as enemy....never.

[Endless]

The hottest place in Hell is reserved for those who remain neutral in times of great moral conflict.
Martin Luther King

Finding Russia guilty for Ukraine is like having Iraq guilty for nuclear weapons which have never been found .

If I say I have boobies, don't you want to come check and see if I do?

[Baton101]

Endless as usual without any argument against. But how can I blame him or anybody else? There is no argument against this, all is clear.

And then people wonder why they get proper insults on themselfs

[Mr.Cows]

Baton. You are just as bad as those who support the U.S and its policies with full ignorance. You just do that for Russia. You are no better. Also you have the tendency to leave the realm of rational (like Kudi said) sometimes when arguing over policies of govts. That is also why I cant support you when you speak against U.S.

Go ahead, lay your insults into a nice row of ignorance.

[Baton101]

That is also why I cant support you when you speak against U.S..

Fine dont support me because of me, support it because of common sense

and about "realm of rational" I have a quote for U, from Spock if u know who he is "Logic is the beginning of all wisdom, not the end."

[Rad Poison]

About that voting on N-TV i have to say, as far as i know it's a german channel, so i don't think it represents all of EU. These votes are solely done by sending a SMS to a specific callnumber with 'Yes' or 'No' as content, you just cant determine if all sorts of people voted (income level, religious believes, political views, etc.) and because of that this voting itself is not representative for 'german society' as a whole, it is only representative for all those who watch that miserable N-TV channel. I wouldn't count much on that voting.

[Baton101]

Rad plz comment this.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/05/20/us-germany-foreignpolicy-idUSBREA4J07620140520

"Four in five Germans want fewer foreign military missions: poll"


and more news...cia spies soldiers killed and wounded in ukraine, hope number will be greater in time.
"At least 650 servicemen were killed, wounded or taken prisoner in the past ten 10 days, he said. There are 70 foreigners among them and of those 13 agents of the US Federal Bureau of Investigation and CIA were killed and 12 others were wounded, Ponomaryov told reporters.Копирано от standartnews.com"

http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/u ... 69953.html

http://rt.com/business/158660-biden-son ... e-company/
Son of US VP Joe Biden appointed to board of major Ukrainian gas company

http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_05_1 ... ster-1753/
Czech Republic opposes hosting NATO's troops - Czech Defense Minister

France refuses to block Mistral warship deal with Russia
http://rt.com/news/158468-france-russia-mistral-deal/

Germany want to continue partnership with Russia despite evil american politicans
http://www.faz.net/aktuell/politik/inla ... 41420.html

Energy sanctions against Russia would be 'inappropriate', EU says
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/05/ ... CN20140516

ussia and China are due to sign a long-awaited gas contract on Tuesday, in which Beijing could pay up to $456 billion for Russian gas over the next 30 years.
http://rt.com/business/159880-gazprom-c ... ssia-cnpc/

Protests in germany against sancionts to Russia
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BV_COzypDHY

Information and internet is a bitch if u know where to look.

that those sanctions would boomerang against America's space effort and essentially told NASA to take a flying leap ... on a trampoline. (in other words, usa dont have tehnology to send astronauts to space)
http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ukrain ... eap-n92616

Germany foreign business minister loosing nerves vecause people of Germany dont support western politics that are in essential nazi politic
http://rt.com/news/160428-steinmeier-lo ... per-video/

[queenofhearts]

i wish i had never asked

[Siсiliаn Ноundd]

Ukrainian forces have ceased fire, but the Russia Rebels fight on. Reports of Russian heavy weapons being removed from front lines. But are within the Ukraine Border still awaiting the ready for more strikes.

US plans on supplying heavy defense weapons and US ground troop training (CNN article 15/3/11).

Simply escalation.. US supplies Ukraine ok.., Putin will counteract with supplying Russian Rebels more then what they already are.

Now NATO & US doing military drills (BBC article 15/3/10) for a Russian attack, its obviously not deescalating.

Conflict with constant evolving of "escalation" & "Terms" leads to risks of the unthinkable... Direct US/Russian force confrontation is risking a war no one will win.

Putin has also made remarks in the near past about Tactical Nuclear Threats against any further resistance... You may blow this off but even with the best intentions, you can have a nuclear war, a nuclear holocaust, through miscalculation, through accidents.

[Baton101]

[You've been told about this Baton. Stop it.]