Defcon

[Jordy...]

So, I read this preview: http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/04/20/hands-on-prison-architect/#more-104900, and got quite concerned whether this really would be the game that could turn Introversions prospects around. Below are some quotes that I think are worrisome.

"The truth is that Introversion are building something that sits within a familiar heritage for PC games, and they are doing it with style."

This worries me, I'm all for style and a good game, but it's time for the game industry to move on, you can't keep producing the same shit over and over again... I was really hoping they would bring some innovating and exciting to whatever this was going to be, but that prospect looks grim..


"Of course there’s also the raw prison-building aspect, and I began afresh as soon as I’d bored of tinkering with the pre-made prison."

The fact that he got bored worries me even more, tinkering with your prison is probably going to be the core gameplay, you shouldn't get bored from this, no matter who built it.


"I also felt, as I built my cells and shower blocks, that there was something missing in the planning element of the game. Perhaps it was my haste to get something put up, but I kept making mistakes, and felt that my prison was less architected than it was simply cobbled together, as if by accident. “Prison Cobbler” doesn’t sound quite the same."

Again, disappointed, this refers back to the first quote, in that they're building something that "sits within a familiar heritage", instead of innovating and perhaps focusing more on the architectural side of things then on the well-known management ideas.

In short, I was hoping for innovation and something exciting, what it looks like it's going to be, is an upgraded version of a management game out of the early 21st century.
I'm sure it will be enjoying, for some time, but without innovation, multiplayer, or something unique to it other then a promised gripping story-line I'm asking myself how much I will enjoy it and how many people this game will attract..

Opinions please!

[Xocrates]

I was expecting Theme Prison, and so far it seems to be delivering. I'm more excited for this than I ever was for Subversion.

[mibias]

Subversion never was anything but an interesting concept to me. Sure, all the tech we've seen has been very cool, but I had no idea how fun the game itself would be.

This, I can see myself sink hours into. The previews have been covering my expectations quite well so far. I'm looking forward to it.

[xander]

Subversion was/is a tech demo. It might make a good game someday, but I see very little indication that is was a good game as of the last time IV said anything about it. Cool tech demos don't always make good games. Prison Architect, on the other hand, looks like fun. I don't really care if it is uses cutting edge technology, or is a major leap forward in the deconstruction of the video game. As long as it is a good game, I'll be happy.

xander

[Jordy...]

Xocrates wrote:

I was expecting Theme Prison, and so far it seems to be delivering. I'm more excited for this than I ever was for Subversion.

I can see that, sure, I have no doubt that it will be a nice game, but there have been tons of theme games even theme prison games, and so far it looks like there is little to differentiate this game from the others, other then perhaps a little higher quality.
Weren't you expecting for IV to do something bold, new and exciting?

Quote:

This, I can see myself sink hours into. The previews have been covering my expectations quite well so far. I'm looking forward to it.

What in the previews have covered your expectations? The RPS review is quite critical about the building aspect, and he got bored tinkering with an existing prison, were do you expect to sink your hours into? Building is clearly not one of the most brain-teasing things to do in this game and managing is rather tiresome..

[Jordy...]

xander wrote:

Subversion was/is a tech demo. It might make a good game someday, but I see very little indication that is was a good game as of the last time IV said anything about it. Cool tech demos don't always make good games. Prison Architect, on the other hand, looks like fun. I don't really care if it is uses cutting edge technology, or is a major leap forward in the deconstruction of the video game. As long as it is a good game, I'll be happy. xander

I'm not expecting cutting edge technology, nor a giant leap-forward in gaming, but I do expect IV to innovate and not take a well-known genre and do nothing new with it, but making a polished game out of that genre. That is not what I thought IV was about, nor what I thought they set out to do when they created IV.

Chris said it was a ton more fun to play this then Subversion in the beginning, but I read that sims-games really come together late in the development cycle and before that it isn't so much fun at all, so I wonder where he derived this fun from.

Also if you all thought subversion didn't seem fun to play, why not say so, now they sank money and time into a black-hole it seems..

[Xocrates]

Jordy... wrote:

there have been tons of theme games even theme prison games

Name one that's actually good.

[Jordy...]

Xocrates wrote:

Jordy... wrote: there have been tons of theme games even theme prison games Name one that's actually good.

I'm not really into them, but I believe theme hospital is a well known and respected theme game, as is dwarf fortress and I doubt they will be able to be better in both scope and gameplay then dwarf fortress if they do not come up with something innovative.
The most they'll have to offer in comparison to dwarf fortress would be, it seems, accessibility and visuals, if that's all you want to achieve then by all means..

[Xocrates]

I meant prison ones.

Also, Dwarf Fortress is pretty much unplayable to the regular person, and theme hospital, while quite good, is pretty damn old. We're in dire need of quality new games in the genre.

[Xarlaxas]

Someone could make a fortune building a UI that is actually *sensible* for Dwarf Fortress, considering how much fun the utter madness that that game generates on a regular basis.

[Jordy...]

Theme games, whether prison ones or hospital ones, are one genre and the theme itself doesn't matter that much gameplay wise I believe.
It's fine if you like theme games and you are waiting for a visually updated version, then be happy with Prison Architect, but until I get to read more I'm quite disappointed with the lack of innovation this game promises and I believe it's not in the IV spirit to just make a decent genre game which is not groundbreaking.

Look at the ambition behind Subversion, and then look at what Prison Architect tries to do.. I feel they are in a slop, they realized they had to churn out a game, they picked a genre which will always attract some people and decided to make a decent game of it.

[NeatNit]

Jordy... wrote:

Theme games, whether prison ones or hospital ones, are one genre and the theme itself doesn't matter that much gameplay wise I believe.

Wrong. Prison Architect features prisoners who can rebel, fight, and use anything that makes sense as a weapon. What other non-prison games offer something close? This one thing changes the gameplay entirely.

[Jordy...]

So, in a prison theme game you have to subdue and prevent fights, in a hospital game you have to subdue and prevent illness.. I'm sure it'll be a fine game..

[Jackdapantyrip]

I think Prison Architect has a lot of potential to be more than just a prison game. Maybe this is just the 1st run for more of an in depth city game..

.. then transfer those cities to defcon 2..

As for Prison Architect itself though I'm somewhat excited but I was looking forward to Subversion a lot more.. I do understand though that to do that game well must be terribly difficult.. especially for a small team.

I do hope though that Prison Architect is like dwarf fortress in that you can connect to the characters greatly depending on all the shit that happens.

Is Prison Architect going to be on the ipad?

Jordy... wrote:

Theme games, whether prison ones or hospital ones, are one genre and the theme itself doesn't matter that much gameplay wise I believe. It's fine if you like theme games and you are waiting for a visually updated version, then be happy with Prison Architect, but until I get to read more I'm quite disappointed with the lack of innovation this game promises and I believe it's not in the IV spirit to just make a decent genre game which is not groundbreaking. Look at the ambition behind Subversion, and then look at what Prison Architect tries to do.. I feel they are in a slop, they realized they had to churn out a game, they picked a genre which will always attract some people and decided to make a decent game of it.

I do feel this way some too.. But maybe Chris is working through some of the problems in subversion with this game.. Iv releases a game does a steam sale and gets more finances to continue innovating?

A Subversion crew heist game looking like Prison Architect could be interesting.

/random thought.. I want to be able to read the prisoners letters from their wives..

Last edited by Jackdapantyrip on Sat Apr 21, 2012 10:15 pm; edited 2 times in total

[Jordy...]

Xarlaxas wrote:

Someone could make a fortune building a UI that is actually *sensible* for Dwarf Fortress, considering how much fun the utter madness that that game generates on a regular basis.

I would sure love to play dwarf fortress, but I'm way too lazy to learn all the commands or whatever and such and the UI is indeed not helping much. I don't need 3d models, but hack, give it a normal appearance for todays standards..